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morphing jar

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hamouda
Kuuga
nwslap12
7 posters

descriptionmorphing jar Emptymorphing jarSat Aug 21, 2010 1:13 am

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in my constant effort to find and build the best alternative win deck i built a deck based on making the opponent discard cards until they have none left and i win by default via morphing jar and needle worm.

i dueled a guy who claimed morphing jar was destroyed before the effect activated meaning i could not shuffle it back into my deck, instead it went straight to the graveyard.
was he right or was morphing jar returned to my deck rather than to the graveyard?

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSat Aug 21, 2010 1:19 am

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morphing jar eff when it's flip face up. So the eff activates then morphing jar goes to grave.

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSat Aug 21, 2010 1:24 am

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but the question is is morphing jar sent to the deck via it's effect, thus avoiding destruction?

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSat Aug 21, 2010 1:59 am

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u had to say that u're speaking abt morphing jar#2

yes it is destroyed before its eff activates so after its effect resolves and returns all other monsters to deck it will be sent to grave (in normal case)

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSat Aug 21, 2010 9:16 am

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Confirm Morphing Jar 2's effect activates after damage calculation before the cards are sanded to the graveyard, so Morphing Jar 2 will be destroyed and sanded to the graveyard.

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSat Aug 21, 2010 12:35 pm

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hmm ok, but i built a deck based on creating a near endless loop by reshuffling morphing jar #2 and using needle worm to make them run out of cards. now that each one will be destroyed before the effect activates, any suggestions for cards to use to accomplish that loop? if i simply flip summonn the jar it will not be destroyed but that severely limits useability cuz all they have to do is attack before i can flip summon and not only does the loop fail but i lose a jar...


EDIT: i thought i could continue using the deck by flip summoning it myself and stalling so they could not attack and destroy it and i am pleased to say it works perfectly, just discarded an experienced infernity player's entire deck while stalling to the extreme.

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSat Aug 21, 2010 3:07 pm

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The loop you are looking for is:

Needle Worm / Morphing Jar #2 / Morphing Jar / Hiro's Shadow Scout

_+_

All-Out Attacks

Wait until you have a Morphing Jar #2 and at least 1 other monster (2 others preferrably) on the field, then activate All-Out Attacks. You'll get the flip effects of all 3 monsters, so if Jar#2 is link 1, the other effects will resolve, then all 3 monsters get sent back to the deck and 3 new monsters come out and are immediately flipped face-up by All-Out Attacks, thus activating all of their flip effects. If 1 of those 3 monsters was Morphing Jar #2, then the cycle continues.

You do need more than just Morphing Jar#2 + Needle Worm for this, the reason being is that you can accidentally create an infinite loop if you don't have Hiro's Shadow Scout of Morphing Jar. Remember that the opponent only loses if he has to DRAW a card and cannot. Needle Worm doesn't make him draw any cards, so even if he can't discard anything for Needle Worm he still hasn't lost.

The other thing to remember is to use Shallow Grave and some stall tactics to allow you to get monsters on the field without them being attacked. You want to set off your flip effects either by flipping them up yourself or by using All-Out Attacks.

FYI: This is a very old deck-type called Empty Jar.

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSun Aug 22, 2010 1:37 am

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im pretty sure all out attacks only works against monsters special summoned while it is on the field. monsters set by me will not all be flipped up at once by it's effect.

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSun Aug 22, 2010 2:43 am

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Because of all out attacks the monster that are special summoed are forced to atk your monsters thus making sure of your monster being flipped face up and thus their mill effects will work.

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSun Aug 22, 2010 4:22 am

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All-Out Attacks:

All monsters that are Special Summoned are changed to face-up Attack Position and must attack, if able, during the turn they are Special Summoned.

Morphing Jar #2:

FLIP: Return all Monster Cards on the field to their respective Decks and shuffle them. You and your opponent then pick up cards until you both have the same number of Monster Cards that were returned to each Deck. Special Summon the Level 4 or lower monsters to the field in face-down Defense Position. The rest of the cards picked up are discarded to the Graveyard.

Even though the monsters summoned by Morphing Jar #2 are summoned face-down, it is STILL a special summon and so the monsters will be immediately flipped face-up by All-Out Attacks and their flip effects will activate. As I said before, this is a very old strategy that has been around for many years and is called an Empty Jar deck.

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSun Aug 22, 2010 12:25 pm

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The_Dutch_Prince wrote:
Because of all out attacks the monster that are special summoed are forced to atk your monsters thus making sure of your monster being flipped face up and thus their mill effects will work.

but you see im trying to avoid the jar actually being attacked because it goes to the grave before the effect activates and i need to keep as many as possible in my deck.

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSun Aug 22, 2010 3:17 pm

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Stall then and flip them during your turn

there's many stall cards. Messenger of peace, gravity bind, level limit area etc

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarSun Aug 22, 2010 4:24 pm

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yes, i built a deck with the only monsters being the morph jars, a sangan, and a hiro shadow scout
all others are stall cards.
worked nicely, and even when hiro is sent to grave and i cannot run the loop i can stall and they usually run out of cards anyway lol!

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarTue Aug 24, 2010 9:01 am

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The OTK uses the effects of "All-Out Attacks", "Morphing Jar #2" and "Hiro's Shadow Scout"/"Poison Mummy" (note that this OTK will only work if you the only monsters in your Deck are "Morphing Jar #2s" and one "Hiro's Shadow Scout" or "Poison Mummy").

This OTK works by activating "All-Out Attacks" and stalling until you have the following face-down monsters:

* Two set "Morphing Jar #2s" OR
* One "Morphing Jar #2" and one "Hiro's Shadow Scout" OR
* One "Morphing Jar #2" and one "Poison Mummy"

Flip Summon a "Morphing Jar #2" and return all monsters on the field to each player's deck. With "Morphing Jar #2's" effect you will end up Special Summoning in face-down Defense Position:

* Two set "Morphing Jar #2s" OR
* One "Morphing Jar #2" and one "Hiro's Shadow Scout" OR
* One "Morphing Jar #2" and one "Poison Mummy"

Once this happens, "All-Out Attacks" will activate, switching all monsters into face-up attack position. Doing so will activate "Morphing Jar #2's", "Hiro's Shadow Scout's" and/or "Poison Mummy's" effects. This will create a loop which will eventually deck out your opponent or reduce their Life Points to 0.

This OTK also works with "Needle Worm" and "Morphing Jar #2". Flipping "Morphing Jar #2" face-up activates the loop; however, it is legal because the loop continues even after the opponent has decked out. So it is batter to use Poison Mummy because of its burn. NOTE: This also works with one to three "Mecha Bunnys" since they special summon each other when they are destroyed. You can stall your opponent once the last one is out and then flip a "Morphing Jar #2" and win the game once their life points are depleted.

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarWed Aug 25, 2010 1:32 pm

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question: do i need the sangan? i just put it in there so there would be a chance for the loop to end, however slim, so i could not be DQed for activating an infinite loop.

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jarWed Aug 25, 2010 1:38 pm

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You dont need sangan. If you use poison mummy/des koala the loop ends when your opp lp hits 0. You can use sangan in a deck destruction deck but it wont be otk then if you get no morphing jar.

descriptionmorphing jar EmptyRe: morphing jar

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